In this episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla welcomes Dr. Doug Kirsch, Medical Director of Atrium Health Sleep Medicine and Clinical Professor in the Department of Neurology at Wake Forest School of Medicine, and Dr. Fariha Abbasi-Feinberg, president-elect of the AASM and private practice physician with Millennium Physician Group in Fort Myers, Florida, to introduce PLATO—a groundbreaking longitudinal assessment tool for obstructive sleep apnea.

The Epworth Sleepiness Scale has been a cornerstone of sleep medicine practice for decades, yet clinicians universally acknowledge its limitations in capturing the full patient experience. Similarly, PAP adherence—while important and part of Medicare's MIPS program—tells only part of the story about treatment success. During his AASM presidency, Dr. Kirsch recognized the need for a more comprehensive metric and convened an expert advisory panel to develop a better solution.

The conversation traces PLATO's development journey, which Dr. Rosen described as "Doug's baby with a prolonged gestation." Starting with 44 potential questions and utilizing the ICON methodology, the panel carefully refined the tool to capture domains beyond simple sleepiness—including quality of life, functional impairment, and symptom burden that the Epworth overlooks. Dr. Kirsch and Dr. Abbasi-Feinberg explain the validation process, how the tool discriminates between OSA severity levels, and why certain seemingly similar questions about sleepiness were all retained.

The episode addresses practical implementation questions: How is PLATO scored? Why do the first two sections use 5-point scales while the final section uses 10 points? Is it free to use, and how does one access it? Will it integrate into electronic health record systems like Epic? Most importantly, how should clinicians use this tool—will it replace the Epworth for Medicare requirements, or does it serve a different purpose?

The discussion also explores how PLATO relates to the recent AHRQ report on OSA treatment outcomes and why the tool focuses on patient-reported symptoms rather than solely cardiovascular endpoints. Dr. Kirsch shares his vision for PLATO's future, including hopes for foundation grants to further study the tool and demonstrate that treating OSA and its associated sleepiness meaningfully improves patient outcomes.

Whether you're frustrated with current assessment limitations, interested in value-based care metrics, or seeking better ways to document treatment efficacy beyond adherence data, this episode provides essential insights into a tool that may reshape how we measure success in sleep medicine.

Join us for this important discussion about moving beyond PAP adherence and Epworth scores to truly capture what matters to our patients.

In this special episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla offers an exclusive preview of the upcoming SleepMedicine Disruptors course, taking place November 14-15 in Austin, Texas. She speaks with Steve Van Hout, executive director of the AASM, and Dr. David White, professor of medicine part time at Harvard Medical School, about the groundbreaking innovations reshaping sleep medicine.

Steve Van Hout explains what makes the Disruptors conference unique compared to other AASM meetings like Trends and the annual SLEEP conference. Designed to bring together clinicians, researchers, technology innovators,and venture capitalists, Disruptors aims to foster cross-industry collaboration and encourage investment in sleep medicine innovations. The conference features innovation award presentations similar to Shark Tank pitches with the audience voting on their favorites, keynote speakers, and discussions about emerging technologies that promise to transform how we diagnose and treat sleep disorders.

Dr. White provides an in-depth preview of his presentation on pharmacotherapy for obstructive sleep apnea, sharing exciting developments in multiple drug candidates. He discusses Apnimed’s AD-109, a combination of atomoxetine and R-oxybutynin, which has completed two phase three studies showing approximately 50% reduction in AHI across six-month and

one-year trials involving over 650 patients each. With FDA submission planned for early 2026, this medication could reach the market by late 2026.

The conversation explores other promising agents including Incannex's combination of dronabinol and acetazolamide, carbonic anhydrase inhibitors like sulthiame (recently licensed by Apnimed), and innovative potassium channelantagonists that could be delivered via nasal spray for localized upper airway effects with minimal systemic absorption. Dr. White discusses the potential for poly therapy approaches, combining medications with devices like mandibular advancement devices or positional therapy, drawing parallels to how hypertension and diabetes are managed with multiple treatments.

The episode tackles important questions about the future of sleep medicine: Will pharmacotherapy replace PAP therapy, or will hybrid approaches become standard? What AHI reduction is clinically meaningful for cardiovascularprotection and symptom improvement? How will pricing and insurance coverage affect accessibility? They emphasize that while these medications may not replace CPAP entirely, they offer promising options for patients who struggle with existing therapies.

Whether you're a sleep medicine practitioner interested in emerging treatments, an entrepreneur exploring innovation opportunities, or simply curious about the future of sleep disorder management, this episode provides essential insights into the rapidly evolving landscape of sleep medicine.

Join us for this forward-looking conversation about innovation, investment, and the technologies poised to disrupt traditional sleep medicine practice.

In this episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla sits down with Dr. Anita Shelgikar, current president of the American Academy of Sleep Medicine, neurologist, and sleep fellowship program director at the University of Michigan, for a transparent look at how the AASM makes critical decisions that shape the field of sleep medicine.

Ever wondered how clinical practice guidelines are developed and why updates take so long? Dr. Shelgikar pulls back the curtain on the comprehensive process behind guideline creation, from topic selection to evidence review to final publication. She explains how the AASM prioritizes which guidelines need updating and how members can influence these decisions.

The conversation addresses pressing concerns facing sleep medicine practitioners: the ongoing review of home sleep apnea testing codes, declining reimbursement rates, and the financial viability of sleep medicine practices. Dr. Shelgikar discusses the AASM's advocacy efforts, recent legislative wins and setbacks, and strategies for improving the value proposition of polysomnography in an evolving healthcare landscape.

Looking toward the future, the discussion explores emerging trends including the potential for inpatient sleep medicine services, the shift toward chronic disease management models, and new technologies like acoustic stimulation. Dr. Shelgikar shares insights on how the field might evolve beyond its traditional testing-focused approach and adapt to changing reimbursement structures.

The episode also demystifies AASM governance: How are committees formed and sunset? Why can't every volunteer serve? What happens during board meetings? Is board membership reserved for academics? Dr. Shelgikar provides practical guidance on how members can engage more meaningfully with the organization and influence its direction.

Whether you're a longtime AASM member curious about organizational decision-making or a newer member seeking to understand how to get involved, this episode offers valuable transparency into the processes that shape sleep medicine policy and practice.

Join us for this informative conversation that bridges organizational leadership with frontline clinical concerns in sleep medicine.

In this episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla welcomes Dr. Faisal Ali, professor of dermatology at the University of Central Lancashire and consultant dermatologist specializing in Mohs micrographic and laser surgery, to explore the fascinating connections between sleep and skin health.

Drawing from recent research published in Clinical and Experimental Dermatology, Dr. Ali explains how sleep serves as a critical regulator of skin physiology, affecting everything from skin surface pH and transepidermal water loss to blood flow and temperature regulation. The conversation delves into the complex interplay of circadian rhythms, hormones, and inflammatory cytokines that govern both sleep patterns and skin homeostasis.

The discussion covers how sleep deprivation accelerates skin aging as an extrinsic factor alongside sun exposure and pollution, with compelling evidence from studies showing that good sleepers have significantly better skin aging scores and improved recovery from UV exposure. Dr. Ali explores the bidirectional nature of this relationship—while poor sleep worsens skin conditions, dermatological disorders like atopic dermatitis, psoriasis, and rosacea can severely disrupt sleep through mechanisms including the itch-scratch cycle and inflammatory processes.

The episode addresses practical clinical concerns including the higher prevalence of sleep disorders in patients with conditions like hidradenitis suppurativa and rosacea, the role of obstructive sleep apnea in various skin conditions, and evidence-based approaches to breaking the itch-scratch cycle that disrupts sleep in dermatological patients.

The conversation also tackles common sleep treatment-related skin issues, from CPAP mask irritation and "maskne" to headgear-induced hair loss, providing practical guidance for managing these complications. Dr. Ali discusses proper skincare routines for CPAP users, including the safety of retinol use under masks and strategies for preventing pressure-related skin breakdown.

Whether you're a sleep medicine practitioner encountering dermatological complaints, a dermatologist treating patients with sleep disruption, or simply interested in optimizing both sleep and skin health, this episode provides evidence-based insights into this often-overlooked connection.

Join us for this comprehensive discussion that bridges dermatology and sleep medicine to enhance patient care and understanding.

In this episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla welcomes Dr. Greg Burek, a psychiatrist and former Marine, and Dr. Dmitriy Kogan, associate professor of medicine at the Medical College of Wisconsin and program director for the sleep medicine fellowship program, to discuss the unique sleep challenges facing military veterans and first responders.

The conversation explores how military and first responder training fundamentally changes individuals, creating an "adrenaline-focused" mindset that profoundly impacts their relationship with sleep and health. Dr. Burek provides insider insights into the stages of military service and the concept of "sacrifice" as a unifying characteristic among veterans, while explaining why many veterans may minimize or dismiss their service experiences.

The guests introduce the BRAVE program, an innovative initiative designed specifically for military veterans and first responders to address the "invisible wounds of service"—PTSD and TBI—and their complex interactions with sleep disorders. Unlike traditional VA programs, BRAVE takes a specialized approach to understanding how military culture and experiences create unique sleep medicine challenges.

The discussion covers critical clinical topics including insomnia management in veterans, the frequent use of clonidine as a treatment option, REM behavior disorder presentations that may differ from civilian populations, and the intricate relationships between PTSD, TBI, sleep-disordered breathing, and nightmare disorders. The experts address whether these sleep disturbances stem from combat trauma, brain injury, or the military experience itself.

This episode provides essential insights for healthcare providers treating veterans, including practical approaches to asking about TBI history, understanding military culture's impact on patient care, and recognizing when specialized referrals may be beneficial.

Whether you're a sleep medicine practitioner, mental health professional, or healthcare provider serving veteran populations, this episode offers valuable perspectives on culturally competent care for those who have served.

Join us for this enlightening discussion that bridges military culture and sleep medicine to improve care for our veterans and first responders.

In this episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla welcomes Dr. Gulcin Benbir, professor of neurology and sleep researcher from Turkey, and Dr. Lourdes Del Rosso, sleep physician and professor at UCSF who served on the task force for updated AASM RLS guidelines, to discuss groundbreaking research on periodic limb movements in sleep (PLMS) that persist after successful sleep apnea treatment.

Following the recent updates to RLS guidelines, this conversation addresses the often-overlooked condition of periodic limb movement disorder (PLMD). The guests reveal surprising findings that challenge traditional teaching: while sleep medicine practitioners have long been taught that PLMD improves with PAP therapy, their research shows that 30% of patients continue to experience significant periodic limb movements even after successful OSA treatment.

The discussion explores critical clinical questions: Are PLMs innocent bystanders or pathological processes requiring treatment? When do PLMs become PLMD? How should we evaluate residual hypersomnolence in well-treated OSA patients—should we screen for persistent PLMs before prescribing wake-promoting agents? The experts also delve into the complex relationship between RLS and PLMs, examining whether they represent interconnected sensory and motor phenomena or distinct processes.

Practical treatment strategies are covered extensively, including the role of iron supplementation, appropriate diagnostic testing, IV iron protocols, and evidence-based pharmacological interventions. The conversation also addresses how the shift toward home sleep testing may impact our ability to detect and treat this important cause of continued sleep disruption.

Whether you're treating OSA patients with persistent daytime sleepiness or managing complex sleep disorders, this episode provides essential insights into recognizing and treating PLMD as a potential contributor to ongoing symptoms.

Join us for this clinically relevant discussion that may change how you approach residual hypersomnolence in your practice.

In this episode of Talking Sleep, host Dr. Seema Khosla welcomes Dr. Luca Baldelli, a neurologist from the University of Bologna and Treasurer-Elect of the International REM Sleep Behavior Disorder Study Group, to discuss breakthrough research on predicting which RBD patients will develop neurodegenerative diseases.

Building on the AASM's updated RBD guidelines, Dr. Baldelli presents compelling evidence for using simple autonomic reflex testing to identify patients at highest risk for phenoconversion to conditions like Parkinson's disease and dementia with Lewy bodies. His research demonstrates that objective autonomic testing, particularly orthostatic assessments, can reveal early neurogenic orthostatic hypotension that precedes overt neurodegeneration by years.

The conversation explores practical clinical applications: How can sleep medicine practitioners implement these screening protocols? What constitutes abnormal autonomic function in RBD patients? How do we interpret changes over time, and when should patients be referred for neurological evaluation? Dr. Baldelli shares his longitudinal monitoring framework that could transform how we counsel RBD patients about their future risk.

This episode addresses critical questions about biomarker development in prodromal neurodegeneration, the timeline of autonomic changes, and evidence-based approaches to patient discussions about prognosis. Dr. Baldelli also discusses current research initiatives and potential therapeutic interventions for high-risk patients.

Whether you're a sleep medicine physician, neurologist, or researcher interested in neurodegenerative diseases, this episode provides essential insights into improving early detection and patient care in RBD.

Join us for this informative discussion that bridges sleep medicine and neurology to enhance clinical decision-making and patient outcomes.